Book of Mormon Notes– How deep can you dig?

2011, April 16

“Member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints/ LDS/ Mormon: The Bible Proves May 21, 2011 Will not Be Judgment Day: Noah Hardly Knew, and Likely neither Will I” by grego

Member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints/ LDS/ Mormon: The Bible Proves May 21, 2011 Will not Be Judgment Day: Noah Hardly Knew, and Likely neither Will I

grego
(c)2011

Noah didn’t know years before. He didn’t know months before. He didn’t know weeks before.

He was finally told *one week* before the Flood to get it all together:
Genesis 7:4 For yet seven days, and I will cause it to rain upon the earth forty days and forty nights; and every living substance that I have made will I destroy from off the face of the earth.

That would be necessary due to the incredible amount of animals and provisions–something not needed this time.

And in fact, that’s what he was doing for that week—getting his family and everything on the ark.

On the day of the beginning of the flood, they get in the ark, and the rain starts:
10 And it came to pass after seven days, that the waters of the flood were upon the earth.
11¶ In the six hundredth year of Noah’s life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened.
12 And the rain was upon the earth forty days and forty nights.
13 In the selfsame day entered Noah, and Shem, and Ham, and Japheth, the sons of Noah, and Noah’s wife, and the three wives of his sons with them, into the ark;

All the time before, he knew it was going to rain; he just didn’t know when. He knew it wouldn’t be before his ark et. al. were ready.

Others could have known the same, had they watched Noah. But they didn’t believe, so what good would watching have done?

It’s the same thing that happened in the Book of Mormon with the birth and death of Jesus Christ. Not even the prophets knew the exact day. In fact, after much pleading prayer in a life-and-death situation, Nephi was told the sign of Christ’s birth would be given a few hours later—the same day!

Signs had been given, and those that had faith watched for them, believed them, and were largely prepared for what happened. Those that didn’t have faith usually disregarded signs, though some watched for them only to not believe them and to think up excuses.

Seeing isn’t believing, and seeing isn’t not believing, either. It’s what you allow yourself to make of it.

Signs have been given about Jesus Christ’s Second Coming, too.

Will Christians survive the second coming? Some will. They won’t be caught up to be with Christ as he comes, but they will survive, and continue to live with Christ on the earth.

Will non-Christians survive the second coming? See above for the same answer.

I’ve found these scriptures that people claim show that you can know. I’ll comment on them just a little:
-=
1 Thessalonians 5:2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.
5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.
6 Therefore let us not asleep, as do others; but let us watch and be sober.

If members of the church knew “perfectly” that they *couldn’t* know, how does this support that one might know when Christ will come? How will we be able to closely ascertain when Crhist will come? By the signs that are given.
Can you know by signs when something will come? Not necessarily.
Can you know by signs when something won’t come? Yes!

-=
Ecclesiastes 8:6 ¶Because to every purpose there is time and judgment, therefore the misery of man is great upon him.

Yes, there is time and judgment; and??

-=
Revelation 3:3 Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.

Is this talking about the Second Coming?? Nope. But the principle is the same: watch for the signs.

There is one clear conclusion: Noah didn’t know the date until the week before, and only because he needed to know it to carry out his part in God’s plan correctly; unless I need that knowledge for similar reasons, neither will I know.

I can, however, watch for the signs and have faith in them. And that’s what we should all do.

So what are some of the signs given in the Bible that will occur before the Second Coming?
**Ezekiel prophesied that Gog, kind of Magog, would invade Israel at the time of the Lord’s second coming (Ezekiel 38–39):
Ezekiel 39:9 And they that dwell in the cities of Israel shall go forth, and shall set on fire and burn the weapons, both the shields and the bucklers, the bows and the arrows, and the handstaves, and the spears, and they shall burn them with fire seven years:
10 So that they shall take no wood out of the field, neither cut down any out of the forests; for they shall burn the weapons with fire: and they shall spoil those that spoiled them, and rob those that robbed them, saith the Lord God.
11¶ And it shall come to pass in that day, that I will give unto Gog a place there of graves in Israel, the valley of the passengers on the east of the sea: and it shall stop the noses of the passengers: and there shall they bury Gog and all his multitude: and they shall call it The valley of Hamon-gog.
12 And seven months shall the house of Israel be burying of them, that they may cleanse the land.

Seven years and seven months, and then more… Has this happened yet? No. Has it even started? I don’t think so.

More:
# The sun shall be darkened and the moon shall not cause her light to shine, Isa. 13:10 (Joel 3:15).
# Israel shall be gathered with power, Isa. 49:22–23.
# God shall set up a kingdom which shall not be destroyed, Dan. 2:44.
# All nations will gather against Jerusalem to battle, Zech. 14:2 (Ezek. 38–39).
# Great calamities shall precede the Second Coming, Matt. 24.
# Paul described apostasy and perilous times of the last days, 2 Tim. 3–4.
# Two prophets will be slain and resurrected in Jerusalem, Rev. 11.
# The gospel shall be restored in the last days by angelic ministry, Rev. 14:6–7.
# Babylon will be established and fall, Rev. 17–18.

Some of them have time limits, too, such as this one:
Revelation 11:2 But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they tread under foot forty and two months.
3 And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.

Two of God’s servants will prophesy in Jerusalem for about 3 1/2 years; have they even started? No.

There are more Biblical prophecies, such as those found under “Major Events Preceding the Second Coming”, found at: http://www.mormonwiki.com/Second_Coming.

So, the Bible itself proves that Judgment Day *cannot be* May 21, 2011, or even anytime soon after.

Could the Second Coming occur within 20 years? Might. Will it come this year? Absolutely not.

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints has other signs, not in the Bible (or made much clearer), for those who are interested. These are in the scriptures (especially the Doctrine and Covenants) and the words of the prophets.

Once more, I urge everyone to listen to the words of God’s true prophets: www.lds.org/study/prophets-speak-today?lang=eng

More on this blog: https://bookofmormonnotes.wordpress.com/2011/03/14/is-may-21-2011-judgment-day-for-the-mormons-lds-church-by-grego/

Words of Joseph Smith on signs and the Second Coming:
“We shall … do well to discern the signs of the times as we pass along, that the day of the Lord may not ‘overtake us as a thief in the night.’ [See D&C 106:4–5.]”4

“I will prophesy that the signs of the coming of the Son of Man are already commenced. One pestilence will desolate after another. We shall soon have war and bloodshed. The moon will be turned into blood. I testify of these things, and that the coming of the Son of Man is nigh, even at your doors. If our souls and our bodies are not looking forth for the coming of the Son of Man; and after we are dead, if we are not looking forth, we shall be among those who are calling for the rocks to fall upon them [see Revelation 6:15–17].”5

“Dearly and beloved brethren, we see that perilous times have come, as was testified of [see 2 Timothy 3:1]. We may look, then, with most perfect assurance, for the fulfillment of all those things that have been written, and with more confidence than ever before, lift up our eyes to the luminary of day, and say in our hearts, Soon thou wilt veil thy blushing face. He that said, ‘Let there be light,’ and there was light [see Genesis 1:3], hath spoken this word. And again, Thou moon, thou dimmer light, thou luminary of night, shalt turn to blood.

“We see that everything is being fulfilled; and that the time shall soon come when the Son of Man shall descend in the clouds of heaven.”6

“The earth will soon be reaped—that is, the wicked must soon be destroyed from off the face of the earth, for the Lord hath spoken it, and who can stay the hand of the Lord, or who is there that can measure arms with the Almighty, for at his commands the heavens and the earth must pass away. The day is fast hastening on when the restoration of all things shall be fulfilled, which all the holy prophets have prophesied of, even unto the gathering in of the house of Israel. Then shall come to pass that the lion shall lie down with the lamb, etc.

“But, brethren, be not discouraged when we tell you of perilous times, for they must shortly come, for the sword, famine, and pestilence are approaching. There shall be great destructions upon the face of this land, for ye need not suppose that one jot or tittle of the prophecies of all the holy prophets shall fail, and there are many that remain to be fulfilled yet. The Lord hath said that a short work will he make of it, and the righteous shall be saved if it be as by fire [see Romans 9:28; 1 Nephi 22:17].”7

“The scripture is ready to be fulfilled when great wars, famines, pestilence, great distress, judgments, etc., are ready to be poured out on the inhabitants of the earth.”8

“We see that perilous times have truly come, and the things which we have so long expected have at last begun to usher in; but when you see the fig tree begin to put forth its leaves, you may know that the summer is nigh at hand [see Matthew 24:32–33]. There will be a short work on the earth. It has now commenced. I suppose there will soon be perplexity all over the earth. Do not let our hearts faint when these things come upon us, for they must come, or the word cannot be fulfilled.”9

“I have asked of the Lord concerning His coming; and while asking the Lord, He gave a sign and said, ‘In the days of Noah I set a bow in the heavens as a sign and token that in any year that the bow should be seen the Lord would not come; but there should be seed time and harvest during that year: but whenever you see the bow withdrawn, it shall be a token that there shall be famine, pestilence, and great distress among the nations, and that the coming of the Messiah is not far distant.’ ”10

“Judah must return, Jerusalem must be rebuilt, and the temple, and water come out from under the temple, and the waters of the Dead Sea be healed [see Ezekiel 47:1–9]. It will take some time to rebuild the walls of the city and the temple, etc.; and all this must be done before the Son of Man will make His appearance. There will be wars and rumors of wars, signs in the heavens above and on the earth beneath, the sun turned into darkness and the moon to blood, earthquakes in divers places, the seas heaving beyond their bounds; then will appear one grand sign of the Son of Man in heaven. But what will the world do? They will say it is a planet, a comet, etc. But the Son of Man will come as the sign of the coming of the Son of Man, which will be as the light of the morning cometh out of the east [see Joseph Smith—Matthew 1:26].”11

“[I] explained concerning the coming of the Son of Man; also that it is a false idea that the Saints will escape all the judgments, whilst the wicked suffer; for all flesh is subject to suffer, and ‘the righteous shall hardly escape’ [see D&C 63:34]; still many of the Saints will escape, for the just shall live by faith [see Habakkuk 2:4]; yet many of the righteous shall fall a prey to disease, to pestilence, etc., by reason of the weakness of the flesh, and yet be saved in the Kingdom of God. So that it is an unhallowed principle to say that such and such have transgressed because they have been preyed upon by disease or death, for all flesh is subject to death; and the Savior has said, ‘Judge not, lest ye be judged.’ [See Matthew 7:1.]”12

Others:
“There is no country in the world with such unruly elements in its population as the
United States. The North American has been prosperous for so long that he is likely to
be driven mad by adversity. The real testing time of the United States is at hand, and
we shall all watch her carefully to see how she carries herself in her darkest hour.
“It has been revealed that the time WILL come in the history of our nation, that one
state will rise against another, one city against another even, even every man’s hand
shall be against his neighbor, until the whole republic will be in general commotion
and warfare. How and when this will take place, the Lord, in his wisdom, has not told
us; but it is sufficient for us to say, that he has told us of the facts that such and such
will be the case.16
“If a war of this description should take place, who could carry on his business in safe-
ty? Who would feel safe to put his crops in the ground, or to carry on any enterprise?
There would be feeling from one state to another and general confusion would exist
throughout the whole Republic. Such eventuality is to be the condition of this whole
nation, and not only this nation, but the nations of Europe.” (Orson Prat, J.D. Vol. 18,
pg. 341)

When we were ready to return, our guide observed, PERHAPS YOU WOULD LIKE TO
LOOK THROUGH THE URIM AND THUMMIM OF GOD, UPON THEIR ABOMINATIONS OF
THE WORLD IN THE DAY OF ITS SIN. YES, WAS OUR REPLY. HE HANDED US THE HOLY
INSTRUMENT. One look and the soul sickened. Eye hath not seen, ear hath not heard,
neither hath it entered into the heart of man what folly, corruptions, and abominations are wrought among men to gratify the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eye and the cunning of the devil. But they shall come.” (Parley P. Prat, printed in the Nauvoo Neighbor)

“An inland Empire will be established in these valleys of mountains, which will be a
place of refuge for millions of people to gather to. When the great day of the judg-
ments of God comes upon the earth, and the righteous come here for safety. Our peo-
ple will go east, west, north and south, but the day will come when they will be glad to
come back. We will be shut out from the rest of the world. (Brigham Young, in Provo Utah)

“I DO NOT WORRY ABOUT THE SAINTS IN POVERTY, BUT WHEN THER LORD SEES FIT TO OPEN THE GREAT OIL RESERVES IN UTAH, I TREMBLE FOR THEM.” (A prophecy made in St. George, Utah by President Brigham Young.

A VISION OF CHARLES D. EVANS
(The following is a vision received by Charles D. Evans, who was a Patriarch to the Church in Springville, Utah, and was a school teacher by profession. In 1893 his vision was published in Volume 15 of The Contributor magazine which was later known as The Improvement Era.)
My vision now became extended in a marvelous manner, and the import of the past labors of Elders was made plain to me. I saw multitudes fleeing to our place of safety in our mountain heights, that was established in the wilderness. Simultaneously, the nation had reached an unparalleled prosperity. Wealth abounded, new territory was acquired, commerce extended, fnance strengthened, confidence was maintained, and people abroad pointed to her as a model nation, the ideal of the past now realized and perfected, the embodiment of the liberty which was sung by poets and sought for by sages.
“But,” continued the messenger, “Thou beholdest a change. Confidence is lost, wealth is arrayed against labor, labor against wealth, yet the land abounds in plenty of food and raiment, and silver and gold in abundance. Thou seest also the letters written by a Jew have wrought a great confusion in the finance of our nation; which altogether with the policy of many wealthy ones, has produced distress and do produce further sorrows.”
Factions now sprang up as if by magic. Capital had entrenched itself against labor, and throughout the land labor was organized in opposition to capital. The voice of the wise sought to tranquilize their powerful factors in vain. Excited multitudes ran wildly about, strikes increased, lawlessness sought a place in the regular government.
At this juncture, I saw floating in the air a banner whereupon was written, “BANKRUPTCY, FAMINE, FLOODS, CYCLONES, BLOOD, AND PLAGUES.” Mad with rage, men and women rushed upon each other. Blood flowed down the streets of cites like water. Thousands of bodies lay unentombed in the streets. Men and women fell dead from terror inspired by fear. This was but the precursor of the bloody work of the morrow. All around lay the mournfulness of a past in ruins. Monuments erected to perpetuate the names of the noble and brave men, were ruthlessly destroyed by combustibles.
A voice now sounded these words; “Yet once again I shake not only the earth, but also heaven, and this word once again signifies the removing of things that are made, that those things that cannot be shaken may remain.”
Earthquakes rent the earth in vast chasms which engulfed multitudes. Terrible groaning and wailings filled the air. The shrieks of the suffering were indescribably awful. Waters rushed in from the tumultuous ocean, whose very roaring under the mad rage of fierce cyclones was unendurable to the ear.
Cites were carried away in an instant. Missiles were hurled through the atmosphere at a terrible velocity, and people were carried upward only to fall. Islands appeared where ocean waves once tossed the gigantic steamer. In other parts, voluminous flames emanated from vast fires, rolled with fearful velocity, destroying life and property in their destructive course.
The seal of the dread menace of despair was stamped on every human visage. Men fell exhausted, appalled and trembling. Every element of agitated nature seemed a demon of wrathful fury. Dense clouds, blacker than midnight, obscured the sunlight with a thunder that reverberated with intonations which shook the earth. Darkness reigned unrivaled and supreme.
Again the light shone revealing an atmosphere tinged with a leaden hue; which was the precursor of an unparalleled plague, whose first symptoms were recognized by a purple spot which appeared on the cheek or on the back of the hand, and which invariably enlarges untl it spread over the inner surface of the body, producing certain death. Mothers, at the sight of it cast away their own children as if they were poisonous reptiles. This plague in grown persons, rotted the eyes from their sockets and consumed the tongue as would a powerful acid or an intense heat. Wicked men, suffering under its writhing agonies, cursed God and died while they yet stood on their feet, and birds of prey feasted on their carcasses.
I saw again in my dream the messenger appear with a vial in his right hand. He addressed me saying, “Thou knowest somewhat of the chemistry taught in the schools of human learning. Behold now a chemical sufficiently powerful to change the waters of the sea.”
He then poured out his vial upon the sea and it became as the blood of a dead man, and every living thing died. Then other plagues followed which I forbear to record.
A foreign power had inroaded the nation, and from every human indication, it appeared as if it would seize the government and supplant it with monarchy.
I stood trembling at the aspect, when a power arose in the west which declared itself in favor of the Constitution IN ITS ORIGINAL FORM. To this suddenly rising power, every lover of constitutional rights gave hearty support. The struggles was fercely contested, but the stars and stripes floated in the breeze, and bidding liberty to all, waved proudly over the land.
Among the many banners, I saw one inscribed thus: “THE GOVERNMENT BASED ON THE CONSTITUTION NOW AND FOREVER!” On another there was, “LIBERTY OF CONSCIENCE.” There were several others both religious and political.

“A time is coming when the great and populous city of New York, the greatest city of
the American Republic, will be left without inhabitants. The houses will stand, some of
them, not all. They will stand unoccupied, no people to inherit them. It will be the same
in numerous other cites, or in the words of the Lord, I will throw down all their strong-
holds and will execute vengeance and fury upon them, even as upon the heathen, such
as they have not heard. It will all be fulfilled, but there will be a remnant who will be
spared.” (Orson Prat, J.D. pg. 295)

“The time is coming when a good man will be more precious than fine gold.” (J.D. Vol.
10, Brigham Young, pg. 295)

“The sinner will slay the sinner, the wicked will fall upon the wicked, until there is an
utter overthrow and consumption upon the face of the whole earth, until God reigns.”
(J.D. 2:190, Brigham Young)

“If we live, we shall see the nations of the Earth arrayed against this people (Later-
day Saints) for that time must come in fulfillment of prophecy.” (J.D. 5:339, Brigham
Young)

“When the testimony of the Elders ceases to be given; and the Lord says to them COME HOME: I WILL NOW PREACH MY OWN SERMONS TO THE NATIONS OF THE EARTH, all you now know can scarcely be called a preface to the sermon that will be preached
with fire and sword, tempests, earthquakes, hail, rain, thunders and lightnings, and
fearful destructions. You will hear of magnificent cites, idolized by the people sinking
in the earth, entombing the inhabitants. The sea will heave itself beyond its bounds,
engulfing mighty cites. Famine will spread over the nations and nation will rise up
against nation, kingdom against kingdom and states against states in our own country
and in foreign lands; and they will destroy each other.”

“All that you know now can scarcely be called a preface to the sermon that will be preached with fire and sword, tempests, earthquakes, hail, rain and fearful destruction. What matters the destruction of a few railway cars? You will hear of magnificent cities, now idolized by the people, sinking in the earth entombing its inhabitants. The sea will heave itself beyond its bounds, engulfing many cities. Famine will spread over the nation, and nation will rise against nation, kingdom against kingdom, states against states, in our own country and in foreign lands.” Brigham Young

“What then will be the condition of the people when the great and dreadful war will come? It will be very different from the war between the North and South. It will be neighborhood against neighborhood, city against city, town against town, state against state, and they will go forth destroying and being destroyed. Manufacturing will almost cease, great cities will be left desolate. The time will come when the great city of New York will be left without inhabitants…

“When that day shall come (when the missionaries will be called home) there shall be wars, not such wars as have come in centuries and years that are past and gone, but a dsolating war. When I say desolating, I mean that it will lay these european nations in waste. Cities will be left vacated, without inhabitants. The people will be destroyed by the sword of their own hands. Not only this but many other cities will be burned; for when contending armies are wrought up with the terrible anger, without the Spirit of God upon them, when they have not that spirit of humanity that now characterizes many of the wars amongst nations, when they are left to themselves, there will be no quarter given, no prisoners taken, but a war of destruction, of desolation, of the burning of the cities and villages, until the land is laid desolate.” (J. Disc. 20: 150) Orson Pratt

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3 Comments »

  1. […] He’s actually got a few interesting points. But for someone who has never done the […]“Member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints/ LDS/ Mormon: The Bible Proves May 21, … 2011, April 16Member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints/ LDS/ Mormon: The Bible […]

    Pingback by “Is May 21, 2011 Judgment Day for the Mormons/ LDS Church?” by grego « Book of Mormon Notes–How deep can you dig? — 2011, April 23 @ 2:48 am

  2. Wow I’ve been inactive for quite a few years but I do believe everything that this article has to say . I don’t think it to be true but I know it to be true .I ve make alot of mistakes in my life but I know my heavenly father loves me and hopefully I will be prepared for this great day when the time comes but I guess I won’t sit on the edge of my seat on may 21 because iit simply is not going to happen. Yet thank you for his article. Meri Luke Yuba city california

    Comment by Meri luke — 2011, May 17 @ 7:22 am

  3. Meri Luke,

    Thanks for sharing . Yes, your Heavenly Father knows and loves you, and He wants you to be prepared to go back to Him. While Jesus won’t come back May 21st, we don’t always know when we will go. Strive for righteousness!

    Best wishes,
    grego

    Comment by grego — 2011, May 18 @ 2:04 pm


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